Who needs a 16 Bil Golem anyway?

Following up on my first foray into “Kill of the Week” posts this past weekend, I decided I wanted to explore that kill a bit more.  As I was writing the piece Sunday night I focused on alternative Golem fits as I sat at my desk musing over the ridiculousness of Nefritiri’s fit.  But last night I wanted to plumb that just a bit further.  Last Night I wanted to see how many CNR fits I could come up with that were not only more tanky than Nefritiri’s Golem, but could out DPS it by a wide margin.  Additionally, I didn’t want to introduce implants, wanted to limit fittings to T2 or Faction as much as possible, and wanted cap stability– either strait out or through limited use of shield boosters or cap boosters.  Not surprisingly, it wasn’t that hard to do.

Before I get to them here’s Nef’s Golem fit again.  I won’t comment on it further, but for comparison sake I’ll just leave this right here:

[Golem, Nefritiri's Golem]
Vepas’ Modified Ballistic Control System
Vepas’ Modified Ballistic Control System
Vepas’ Modified Ballistic Control System
Cormack’s Modified Power Diagnostic System

Gist X-Type X-Large Shield Booster
Cap Recharger II
Experimental 100MN Afterburner I
Pith X-Type EM Ward Field
Pith X-Type Explosive Deflection Field
Pith X-Type Kinetic Deflection Field
Pith X-Type Thermic Dissipation Field

Large Energy Transfer Array II
Large Energy Transfer Array II
Vepas’ Modified Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Vepas’ Modified Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Vepas’ Modified Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Vepas’ Modified Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Small Tractor Beam I

Large Capacitor Control Circuit II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit II

DPS: 600 w/T1 missiles in his hold/812 over-heated.  690 with Navy missiles/812 over-heated.  Long range.
EHP: 69.5k (64% EM/78.4% Ther/81.1% Kin/82% Exp)
Cost: 16+ Bill

In comparison, here’s an omni-tank (not really a good one at that) Cruise Missile CNR sans prop mod.  I’m not a real fan of omni-tanking mission boats in hisec, and even less of mission boats without prop mods so I probably wouldn’t fly this ship specially as fit.  But its an option for some none the less.   The key point is I was simply working at CNR fits that were equally/more tanky and out DPS’d the 16 Bil Golem.  This meets those criteria and when it comes right down to it, would do just fine as a mission boat.  Most importantly, it costs only 13 % as much as the Golem did.

[Raven Navy Issue, LVL 4 PVE Cruise]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Ballistic Control System II
Co-Processor I

Dread Guristas X-Large Shield Booster
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Dread Guristas Shield Boost Amplifier
Caldari Navy Large Shield Extender
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800

Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Drone Link Augmentor I

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I

Hobgoblin II x5

DPS: 588 w/T1 missiles/692 over-heated.  677 with Navy missiles/796 over-heated.  824 w/Fury’s/969 over-heated.  Long range.
EHP: 77.1k (48.3% EM/58.6% Ther/69% Kin/74.1% Exp)
Cost:  1.2 Bil

Obviously there’s quite a bit you can swap out to make this a better mission boat and still meet my criteria.  For instance, for mission running in hisec it’s generally best practice to specifically harden for the damage type of the mission.  Remove the Invulns and drop in two specific hardeners, remove the large shield extender and drop in a DC II, a target painter and a prop mod for:

[Raven Navy Issue, LVL 4 PVE Cruise Var 1]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Ballistic Control System II
Damage Control II

Dread Guristas X-Large Shield Booster
Dread Guristas Shield Boost Amplifier
Caldari Navy Kinetic Deflection Field
Caldari Navy Explosive Deflection Field
‘Inception’ Target Painter I
Republic Fleet 100MN Afterburner

Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Small Tractor Beam I

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I

Hobgoblin II x5

DPS: 588 w/T1 missiles/692 over-heated.  677 with Navy missiles/796 over-heated.  824 w/Fury’s/969 over-heated.  Long range.
EHP: 80.8k (12.5% EM/30% Ther/76.4% Kin/80.3% Exp)
Cost:  1.3 Bil

But the real fun comes from Torp fit CNRs.  At 1.8 Bil this Torp CNR leaves the Golem in the dust.  Even using T1 Torps!

[Raven Navy Issue, LVL 4 PVE Torp]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Damage Control II
Co-Processor I

Dread Guristas Large Shield Booster
Dread Guristas Shield Boost Amplifier
Federation Navy 100MN Afterburner
Caldari Navy Kinetic Deflection Field
Caldari Navy Explosive Deflection Field
‘Inception’ Target Painter I

Caldari Navy Torpedo Launcher, Scourge Torpedo
Caldari Navy Torpedo Launcher, Scourge Torpedo
Caldari Navy Torpedo Launcher, Scourge Torpedo
Caldari Navy Torpedo Launcher, Scourge Torpedo
Caldari Navy Torpedo Launcher, Scourge Torpedo
Caldari Navy Torpedo Launcher, Scourge Torpedo
Caldari Navy Torpedo Launcher, Scourge Torpedo
Drone Link Augmentor II

Large Warhead Flare Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I

Hobgoblin II x5

DPS: 1047 w/T1 missiles/1232 over-heated out to 29.1km.  1203 with Navy missiles/1415 over-heated out to 29.1km.  Short Range.
EHP: 80.8k (12.5% EM/30% Ther/76.4% Kin/80.3% Exp)
Cost:  1.8 Bil

I used the Caldari faction launchers on purpose just to prove a point, I’m not actually advocating their use.  Instead I’d advocate swapping those for the T2 launchers to give yourself additional mid-range options with Javelins and eye bleeding short range DPS with Fury’s.

DPS:  916 w/Javelins/1078 over-heated out to 45.5km.  1375 w/Fury’s/1618 over-heated out to 24.1km.
Cost:  1.2 Bil

If you weren’t laughing at Nef last night, I certainly hope you are now!

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3 Responses to Who needs a 16 Bil Golem anyway?

  1. Nazarielle says:

    Wait a Shield Extender on an active tanking ship? That’s a big no-no. Either put a Cap Recharger or a TP. That Extender won’t really do you much good. I’m sure on paper it gives more tank because of the passive recharge, but it’s really quite irrelevant in practice.

    It’s been a while since I’ve used anything aside from my Tengu for running L4s, but I never needed an AB on my Golem and I don’t really see why people insist on it.

    And I know you’re using a CNR, but for a Torp fit, you really need to use the rig slots for T2 Hydraulic Bay Thrusters and Rocket Fuel Cache. With one of each, on a Golem your Javelins can punch out to ~65km with max skills (~68km with implants), which is typically more than enough even for the really stubborn BS’s like Centus Tyrants (who typically hover around 49km). This also gives you better range on your Faction/Rage Torps letting you do better DPS out further. This plus multiple TPs allows you do to good DPS at acceptable ranges, making a crazy good mission running monster.

    Concerning hardeners, I usually do the same. However, two Caldari Navy Invulns gives better resists than two T2 damage specific hardeners (assuming they’re not the same type e.g. both EM). Of course, they’re also loads more expensive and one of the reasons I never actually got them. Also, as you say, I’d never use faction or T1 meta Torp Launchers. You just absolutely have to be able to load Javelins.

    I’m also curious about sustained/reinforced tank on those fits vs different mission NPC types. The Torp CNR seems woefully undertanked considering it’ll need to be withim 45 km to hit anything at all.

    • Iggep says:

      The LSE is absolutely arguable, granted. Not sure I’d go so far to say it’s a no-no, after all it does give more shield (46k from 37.5). But for the sake of argument remove it and drop in an Adaptive Invuln Field II, which would bring shields up to 41k base and 45.2k on. That’s less actual shield strength than with the LSE but the trade off is higher resists. 57.1% EM from 48.3%, 65.7 Therm from 58.6%, 74.3 Kin from 69%, and 78.6% Exp from 74.1%. In hi-sec mission running I’m generally not worried about the alternate resists so the question comes down to is the slightly higher primary resists better than the slightly better shield strength? Interesting about the Caldari Invulns though…. I’ll have to look at that and see where I stand.

      I know you’ve made the comment before about prop mods, but I just have to go with what I said on Twitter. I just don’t like being without one. Some of those missions you’re a good distance from gates, not to mention a good distance from some of the outlying groups. I’d rather travel at 330ish m/s than 100ish m/s!

      The Rig slots are something I went back and forth on, and in my mind what tipped the balance was a desire to increase applicable DPS on smaller targets. Traded some range for that and felt okay with that considering I almost always opt for a prop mod. Still have to travel out to many groups but honestly if I know I’m taking a mission where I really need reach I usually switch to Cruise Missiles anyway. And then its just not a problem 824 DPS (969 OH) is plenty for virtually all LVL 4 missions. My Torp fits have less shield strength but with their DPS on short to mid range targets it just doesn’t matter.

      [Raven Navy Issue, LVL 4 PVE Cruise Var 1]
      Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
      Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
      Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
      Ballistic Control System II
      Damage Control II

      Dread Guristas X-Large Shield Booster
      Dread Guristas Shield Boost Amplifier
      Caldari Navy Kinetic Deflection Field
      Caldari Navy Explosive Deflection Field
      ‘Inception’ Target Painter I
      Republic Fleet 100MN Afterburner

      Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
      Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
      Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
      Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
      Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
      Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
      Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
      Small Tractor Beam I

      Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
      Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
      Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I

      Hobgoblin II x5

      • Nazarielle says:

        Hmm… I suppose I just don’t do missions that really require a lot of trundling along to gates. I can’t even really think of any that I regularly run that have more than 5-8km to a gate.

        As for the LSE, it definitely helps against gankers by increasing your overall shield EHP. The thing is, since you’re going to be running your repper a lot, the passive shield recharge you get from adding it probably isn’t going to actually come into play. You’ll just end up boosting instead of passive recharging. So really, you’re just giving yourself more overall shield to rep up. I guess it does buy you more time before you might have to warp out if your tank is failing, but that’s not the way you want to build a PvE ship.

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